Ray Nagin
To be honest, I've always supported Ray Nagin. I think he's one of the few people who actually came out and said what everyone was thinking: that what happened after Katrina wouldn't have happened if it had been a rich white neighborhood. I think we needed someone to say that, and I think he did and did it well.
However, when he said this: "You guys in New York can't get a hole in the ground fixed, and it's five years later. So let's be fair". I think that crossed a line. It's not "a hole in the ground". it's where three thousand people lost their lives. He apologized, and I accept that, he worded it badly. Very badly.
I think he brought attention to something very important though, why the hell is there still a mess at ground zero? We've had five years, why isn't there a monument up? We've spend billions of dollars on a war in Iraq that had nothing to do with 9/11 and yet we can't even build a memorial to the people who lost their lives on 9/11. it's disgusting. blame it on bloomberg, blame it on whoever, it still should get done.
as should Katrina. why is there still a mess down there? True, it's only been a year, but there still hasn't been that much progress. our government is just lazy and this is further proof that they really don't care about the American people.
Sorry I haven't posted in a while, I've been very busy. i'm soo tired and stressed right now, I need a year vacation. never happen in a million years...but I can still dream. Robert, I'm working on that post I promised you, I really am. it just hasn't really gotten off the ground yet NOT because I can't find examples, rather I can't find time. soon soon though.
However, when he said this: "You guys in New York can't get a hole in the ground fixed, and it's five years later. So let's be fair". I think that crossed a line. It's not "a hole in the ground". it's where three thousand people lost their lives. He apologized, and I accept that, he worded it badly. Very badly.
I think he brought attention to something very important though, why the hell is there still a mess at ground zero? We've had five years, why isn't there a monument up? We've spend billions of dollars on a war in Iraq that had nothing to do with 9/11 and yet we can't even build a memorial to the people who lost their lives on 9/11. it's disgusting. blame it on bloomberg, blame it on whoever, it still should get done.
as should Katrina. why is there still a mess down there? True, it's only been a year, but there still hasn't been that much progress. our government is just lazy and this is further proof that they really don't care about the American people.
Sorry I haven't posted in a while, I've been very busy. i'm soo tired and stressed right now, I need a year vacation. never happen in a million years...but I can still dream. Robert, I'm working on that post I promised you, I really am. it just hasn't really gotten off the ground yet NOT because I can't find examples, rather I can't find time. soon soon though.
posted by Ellie @ 3:11 PM
23 Comments:
At 8/31/2006 10:39:00 PM,
Robert said…
Honey, don't worry about it. I am not going anywhere...
A Nagin? A walking catastrophe from day one. Anyone in his position that didn't have a contingency plan for something is sadly incompetent.
He has been way over the top for a year. Like when he said that New Orleans wil be a "Chocolate New Orleans..the way it should be."
At 8/31/2006 11:21:00 PM,
Human said…
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
At 9/01/2006 12:38:00 AM,
Human said…
Oh gosh. I really have to disagree w/ you on this Ellie. He's as racist as they come. The corruption that he put up with before Katrina in deplorable.
The brutal beating by the cops that was caught on tape was not an aberration. He knew what type of PD he had.
I don't blame him for any response to Katrina though. As soon as the Feds took over it was outta of his hands. Omn a personal level though he should have done more.
Peace.
Peace.
At 9/01/2006 01:06:00 AM,
The Future Was Yesterday said…
Nagin may have said what everybody was thinking, re rich white neighborhood, but I believe he's a racist in disguise, and used that example to pit one race against the other. Having said that, what has happened to N.O is criminal. And Robert? He HAD a contingency plan; it was called evacuation. It couldn't be carried out until the government gives him the transportation THEY had in THEIR contingency plan for that city!!
Re the "hole in the ground." Bad choice of words; the politically correct will eat him up on this; that does nothing to erase the truth of his statement. So why hasn't a monument been erected? Because a bunch of self serving, multi millionaires are fighting among themselves over "what would be the best monument." Read: how can I best spin this to my advantage?
Hope you get that vacation soon; I know the feeling all too well..(:
At 9/01/2006 08:51:00 AM,
Robert said…
Future, evacuation without a mechanism to carry it through is meaningless. If he was relying on the fed govt for transportation, why didnt he ask for it 3 days before landfall?
At 9/01/2006 10:40:00 AM,
Ellie said…
robert - I really didn't like that comment about New Orleans being a chocolate city. another really bad choice of words on his part. I have to agree with future on this one, his contingency plan was the federal government. I seem to remember him asking for things and not getting anything. I seem to remember many warnings and the federal government sitting back and ignoring all of them.
human - wow, we disagree on something. I think this is a first. :) I don't see what more he could have done though. the Feds took over, and did nothing. then they wanted to use him as their scape goat and he refused. then he started on about how racist the government was. We needed someone to say that, and he was the guy who did. I wasn't aware of corruption in his PD (I probably should have done more research before I posted). and what you are saying he knew about is horrible. however, I think his response to Katrina was right on.
future - agreed. I'm not sure if he's a racist in disguise...but that chocolate comment was pretty racist. I wish the multi-millionaires would just shut up and stop trying to get the most out of it and just build a monument. I want it to be special and well-thought out and everything...but goodness, they've had FIVE years.
Right now i'm hoping to go to Ireland over Christmas. Although the weather is going to be pretty bad over there in December. and that's a long time away... but I shall see. thanks. :)
At 9/01/2006 10:43:00 AM,
Ellie said…
another interesting thing I forgot to add to this post was something I heard on TV after Katrina. This was probably only said once or twice because I never heard it again.
In one town outside New Orleans the police and other personnel were standing with guns pointed at the Katrina victims who were looking for refuge. They wouldn't let them into their towns and were using guns to keep them out.
When you talk about evacuation plans, this is one of the reasons why things didn't go so well (in addition to a failure of our government). i think those poeple in that town should be brought to justice, but it'll never happen.
At 9/01/2006 01:15:00 PM,
Robert said…
I think that people should quit relying on the federal government for their breast milk and grow up.
Neither the mayor or the governor asked for help BEFORE the storm. That is the crucial time when nothing happened. Nagin didn't do a thing, other than move his command post. Was the fed govt slow to respond? Of course. owever, Nagin didn't do a thing except scream and pass the buck afterwards.
You don't see what more he could have done? Remember those 500 school buses?
At 9/01/2006 11:03:00 PM,
Anonymous said…
Regardless of what Nagin did or did not do, or government failed to help the people of the entire gulf coast within a reasonable time line.
When the news starts showing you pictures of corpses floating in the water and covered in wheel chairs, what the "eff" does it take to go into action?!
Forget the twits in charge locally - if you plan to be the leader of the free world, then be the "effing" leader in your own country first! Especially in times of need like Katrina.
Bush has no problem dropping MRE's through-out the foreign lands we invade, but couldn't muster even that much for the people stuck at the Super Dome! What about the National Guard! Oops, I forgot, most of them are in Iraq.
Please - enough of the excuses already. The Bush administration needs to admit fault and make it right. Nothing more than simple than that.
At 9/01/2006 11:18:00 PM,
Human said…
Ellie - You are refering to what is known as "The Battle of Gretna Bridge". It is indeed true. The only reason we know about it was many whites were in that group. The Gretna police refused sancturary to them because they did not want the Blacks to be in Gretna.
One young black man helped a group of whites escape. The grey haired white man was interviewed on tv. He said he owed his and his families life to him. They would not tell what route they took so as not to alert "authorities" to the escape route. The young black man, a true hero said he was going back in to help more people escape.
The group that stayed near the bridge, organized and built shelters, helicopters came and flying low tore the shelters up with the force of the wash. Not once, but twice. There were women and children there.
The lack and impediment of help to the people of New Orleans had racism written all over it. It was by design. Over 600 airboaters from neighboring areas tried to enter New Orleans and were turned back. There were many such type of instances as this. The greatest lie about the whole thing was that sob Bush saying to paraphrase "NO one ever thought the levees would break." and the cream(curdeled as it turned out) was "Help is on the way".
The whole Nation saw what the government was made of. The only supporters the Bush Regime has now is the fanatics. Some good may come out of it all.
What I meant on the personal level was he should of been rescuing people himself intead of having photo ops w/Bush. Since it was out of his hands after the feds took over that is. Also that truth would have been more accepted if he was seen rescuing people himself. Just think of what the MSm would of asked him, "Should you not be at the Command Center or Directing it from above" or something like that. He could then have said, No, the feds have control now and ugh, here can you help me carry this lady out?"
Or better yet, he should have been at the "Battle of Gretna Bridge".
Then again, I don't really think he cares that much anyway.
Peace, and I still luv ya Ellie.
xoxo
At 9/02/2006 03:33:00 AM,
Dervish Z Sanders said…
Human said... Oh gosh. I really have to disagree w/ you on this Ellie. He's as racist as they come.
Can you give any examples? I am not aware of any evidence suggesting this.
ellie Said... I really didn't like that comment about New Orleans being a chocolate city. another really bad choice of words on his part.
What he was saying was that that the population of New Orleans consisted of Black and White people (referring to the combination as "chocolate") before Katrina, and that it should stay that way. He is against letting this happen:
Fewer Poor Blacks in New Orleans: In an interview with the Houston Chronicle, HUD Secretary Alphonso Jackson predicted New Orleans would slowly bring back as many as 375,000 people, but that only 35 to 40 percent of the population would be black. Prior to Hurricane Katrina the city had nearly 500,000 residents, more than two-thirds of whom were African-American.
Jackson, who was appointed by Bush to aid in the reconstruction of the city, made it clear that such an outcome was not simply the product of the hurricane and flooding, but the desired policy of the Bush administration and the city’s political and financial elite.
Because the worst hit areas were low-income minority neighborhoods, Jackson added, they may never be repopulated. "I’m telling you, as HUD secretary and having been a developer and a planner, that’s how it’s going to be", he said.
Jackson also acknowledged he had told New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin not to rebuild the city's predominantly poor and black Ninth Ward neighborhood.
The federal government has done nothing to provide shelter or low-cost housing for the majority of the 350,000 families displaced by Hurricane Katrina, and many are little more than refugees spread across the US. Well aware that the lack of affordable housing and employment will make it impossible for most poor people to return to New Orleans, FEMA officials are now openly encouraging low-income workers to move elsewhere.
Alphonso Jackson's comments that New Orleans would no longer be a black-majority city have certainly been welcomed by the most bigoted elements. At heart, however, he expresses the contempt for the working class shared by all layers of the wealthy elite, black and white. Jackson, who is black, was the president of American Electric Power—Texas, a $13 billion utility company, before his nomination by Bush to be HUD deputy secretary in 2001.
Indeed, Jackson only said publicly what the business and political establishment in New Orleans and throughout the US have been discussing privately. For these elites the hurricane is seen as a golden opportunity to rid the city of "undesirable" elements—through a sort of "class-cleansing" -- and a chance to reshape New Orleans in their own interests, with further tax cuts and billions in government rebuilding contracts. (10/4/2005)
What I don't understand is why anyone had a problem with this comment.
Nagin's apology and clarification: "How do you make chocolate? You take dark chocolate, you mix it with white milk, and it becomes a delicious drink. That is the chocolate I am talking about", he said. "New Orleans was a chocolate city before Katrina. It is going to be a chocolate city after. How is that divisive? It is white and black working together, coming together and making something special". (1/18/2006, Nagin apologizes for "chocolate" city comments, CNN)
I don't know why he apologized. I don't think he said anything he needed to apologize for.
Robert Said... Neither the mayor or the governor asked for help BEFORE the storm.
The Governor most certainly did request assistance.
If anyone's interested in the whole truth behind the school bus issue, I suggest reading this article: Putting School Buses Into Perspective
Personally, I think that bush is guilty of negligent homicide for his lack of a response.
human Said... The lack and impediment of help to the people of New Orleans had racism written all over it. It was by design.
I agree it was by design, but I don't think it was racism. I think it was classism. George Bush doesn't hate Black people -- he hates POOR people.
At 9/02/2006 11:49:00 PM,
Ellie said…
robert, I think beltway said it best "if you plan to be the leader of the free world, then be the "effing" leader in your own country first! Especially in times of need like Katrina."
beltway, the Bush administration keeps blaming things on other people and refuses to take any of the blame itself. they just don't care about the american people. all they care about is themselves and their own money. the people in new orleans meant nothing to them, and still mean nothing to them. that's probably the main reason why not much has been accomplished towards clean up. it's disgusting how bush can sit back and point fingers at other people when he's responsible for most of it.
human - thanks for the details, I wasn't sure about all of them. I think you're right, it would have looked much better if nagin had been down there helping people out, just the way it was beneficial to giuliani that he was down at ground zero on september 11th.
looks like we do agree after all. :) luv ya too human. xoxo.
w-dervish, great info, as usual. I wasn't aware of the context of the chocolate city comment. I now see that he didn't mean anything offenseful, but he should make sure that his comments can't be misinterpreted. because taken out of context, it sounds like an only black city, to me atleast. He should have used a better example that was somewhat self explanatory. say, chocolate milk if you have to stick to the chocolate idea.
I wouldn't be surprised if the whole new orleans area turns into a bunch of rich white people who vote republican every time. it's really disgusting how bush doesnt' care about the poor people and the black people and the victims of hurricane katrina in general.
say 9/11 happened in harlem or some poor section of brooklyn, queens or the bronx. would we have seen a response similar to katrina, because it happened in a poor section? or would we see a strong response simply because we could go to war with an innocent country because it serves the president's financial interests?
At 9/03/2006 09:42:00 AM,
Robert said…
He came up with the bs about it being a blend AFTER the huge uproar. Give me a break.
At 9/03/2006 01:37:00 PM,
Ellie said…
um...not sure on that one. although i can see what you're saying. if he meant a blend he needed a better analogy.
At 9/04/2006 08:27:00 AM,
American Crusader said…
Sorry...but as a fellow New Yorker I'm not accepting his apology. Nagin was quick to blame the feds (most of it deserved) but he failed to evacuate the city after Bush had called a state of emergency. While New York's first responders ran towards disaster, New Orleans firefighters and police deserted.
At 9/04/2006 08:30:00 AM,
American Crusader said…
"What he was saying was that that the population of New Orleans consisted of Black and White people (referring to the combination as "chocolate") before Katrina, and that it should stay that way."
Please...if you believe that I know a bridge in Brooklyn that I can get you a great deal on.
At 9/04/2006 10:22:00 AM,
Obob said…
his reelection epitomizes the dysfunction of the city and the state. How much money did he come up with?
At 9/04/2006 07:20:00 PM,
Dervish Z Sanders said…
Robert and American Crusader: It was clear from the context what he meant.
The article I posted points out that poor blacks are being forced out of NO -- Nagin was taking a stand against that happening.
If you want to ignore what it was he was really talking about -- simply so you can label him a racist -- go ahead. IMO it doesn't make you look too bright.
Anyway, I don't really care what your opinion of Ray Nagin is. I wouldn't call myself a Nagin supporter. Has he actually done anything to help poor blacks return? I've also heard him referred to as a "dyed in the Wool" Republican who only switched parties so he could win in a predominately Democratic district.
I need some more information before I make up my mind about him -- but I won't be forming negative opinions based on twisted misquotes.
ellie: Thanks for the comment on my blog -- but you responded to the short post. The one below it took a lot longer to compose!
At 9/05/2006 08:03:00 AM,
Robert said…
Ellie, act quickly! Jump on the party poker thing before it is too late!
At 9/06/2006 08:31:00 PM,
Human said…
I don't accept his explanation. If Mayor Nagin is the best they can God help'em.
Peace.
At 9/08/2006 12:38:00 AM,
Ellie said…
american crusader - welcome! good to have another New Yorker around. :) he put blame where blame was due, right on the feds. he just used a bad choice of words. how much did you say the brooklyn bridge was running for? j/k.
obob - his reelection shows that the people of New Orleans support him blaming the Feds, because they were responsible.
w-dervish - i'll look at the other posts later. I seem to remember being very tired that day. Sorry, my work load never seems to end. I'll be over soon though. :)
shara - not a big fan of party poker.
robert - not a fan. you want it, it's all yours.
human - well...bush was the best the Repubs had in 2000 and 2004... it could be worse.
At 9/13/2006 02:31:00 PM,
Laurie said…
There's a way to tell the state and local politicans in New York that it's time something gets done with Ground Zero, but calling it a "hole in the ground" isn't it. Although he may have inadvertently brought up a valid point, he did so in poor taste. I have no respect for this idiot.
At 10/03/2006 01:22:00 AM,
Dardin Soto said…
i just took a month off and just did my first post since then..........ahhhhhhhhhhh what a different view when you are fully rested, love ya!
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